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	<title>Comments on: What Does the Bible Say About Modesty?</title>
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	<link>http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/</link>
	<description>Standing in the Gap in a Society that&#039;s Warring with God.</description>
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		<title>By: FatherOf4</title>
		<link>http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/comment-page-1/#comment-88061</link>
		<dc:creator>FatherOf4</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Nov 2011 14:40:52 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>@Pat
There are quite a few verse which talk about violence and quite a few examples of Jesus refusing to condone violence and refuting it.  Your specific example of drive-by in LA is covered in Scripture.  You are correct, it is all about the heart/motivation.  A woman who wears low cut tops or short skirts is wrong if her motivation is to attract unrighteous attention to herself.  You and I however, can not determine her motivation/heart and therefore have no business judging her.
Why, as a man, should I not find other women attractive?  Can I not tell my daughter or my mother she is beautiful?  Are they not created in God&#039;s image as well?  Did he not pronounce Eve&#039;s body &quot;good&quot;?  The attraction to others is not wrong.  The actions (deed and thought) based on the attraction is the problem.</description>
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@Pat<br />
There are quite a few verse which talk about violence and quite a few examples of Jesus refusing to condone violence and refuting it.  Your specific example of drive-by in LA is covered in Scripture.  You are correct, it is all about the heart/motivation.  A woman who wears low cut tops or short skirts is wrong if her motivation is to attract unrighteous attention to herself.  You and I however, can not determine her motivation/heart and therefore have no business judging her.<br />
Why, as a man, should I not find other women attractive?  Can I not tell my daughter or my mother she is beautiful?  Are they not created in God&#8217;s image as well?  Did he not pronounce Eve&#8217;s body &#8220;good&#8221;?  The attraction to others is not wrong.  The actions (deed and thought) based on the attraction is the problem.</p>
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		<title>By: FatherOf4</title>
		<link>http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/comment-page-1/#comment-88060</link>
		<dc:creator>FatherOf4</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Nov 2011 14:24:47 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>@Sabrina - your apparel or lack thereof did NOT &quot;cause a lot of men to lust after your figure.&quot;  They did NOT come into the club to see your dance clothes.  They came into the club to lust and you were there to be lusted after.  (This does not mean you did not encourage their lusts by your dancing.)  You are not responsible for theirs or my actions and thoughts.  You are accountable for your own actions and thoughts.

As for the link you suggested, while he (the author) appears to back it up from Scripture, he is selective regarding which verses to use and ignorant of history.  Pants were worn by 15th century Korean women and 4th century Pakistani women.  In short he is interpreting the ancient texts of the Bible based on his current cultural viewpoint.</description>
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@Sabrina &#8211; your apparel or lack thereof did NOT &#8220;cause a lot of men to lust after your figure.&#8221;  They did NOT come into the club to see your dance clothes.  They came into the club to lust and you were there to be lusted after.  (This does not mean you did not encourage their lusts by your dancing.)  You are not responsible for theirs or my actions and thoughts.  You are accountable for your own actions and thoughts.</p>
<p>As for the link you suggested, while he (the author) appears to back it up from Scripture, he is selective regarding which verses to use and ignorant of history.  Pants were worn by 15th century Korean women and 4th century Pakistani women.  In short he is interpreting the ancient texts of the Bible based on his current cultural viewpoint.</p>
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		<title>By: J</title>
		<link>http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/comment-page-1/#comment-88051</link>
		<dc:creator>J</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Oct 2011 18:28:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/#comment-88051</guid>
		<description>When it comes to skirts how short is too short?</description>
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When it comes to skirts how short is too short?</p>
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		<title>By: Sabrina</title>
		<link>http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/comment-page-1/#comment-88046</link>
		<dc:creator>Sabrina</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Oct 2011 00:40:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/#comment-88046</guid>
		<description>I am an ex exotic dancer of 10 years and a newly devoted christian and I can surely tell you that what a women wears does matter. The bible is quite clear on the apparel for both men and women. Deuteronomy 22:5 The women shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a women&#039;s garment for all that do so are abonmination unto the Lord thy God. 
1 Timothy 2:9 I also want women to dress modestly, with decency, and propriety, not with braided hair of gold or pearls or expensive clothes (with shamefacedness) but with good deeds appropriate for women who profess to worship God.
This does not go to say that women should not dress fashionable, it suggest modestly not overdone or too exposed. Too much of anything is not good for you. Shamefacedness simply means not to draw attention to yourself. Anything tight or form fitting shows off your figure whether it be pants, shorts, skirts, or dressess and is therefore not shamefacedness! Men are naturally attracted to a womens curves this is how God has designed them. A women should guard herself and protect her future husband from falling short. The bible says in 1 Corinthians 13 &quot;Charity doth not behave itself unseemly.&quot; You shouldnt seek to do things that would cause someone to fall. Jesus says that if a man looks at a women with lust in his heart, he has already committed adultry. Being an ex exotic dancer, my apparel caused alot of men to lust after my figure and thus I lured them into committing adultry in their heart which I am not proud to admit.
I have found a great link online that has some great backup biblical literature on this sort of topic. I suggest that everyone check it out. It address questions of how short is too short and the reasons why things are the way they are.
http://www.momof9splace.com/sermon.html</description>
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I am an ex exotic dancer of 10 years and a newly devoted christian and I can surely tell you that what a women wears does matter. The bible is quite clear on the apparel for both men and women. Deuteronomy 22:5 The women shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a women&#8217;s garment for all that do so are abonmination unto the Lord thy God.<br />
1 Timothy 2:9 I also want women to dress modestly, with decency, and propriety, not with braided hair of gold or pearls or expensive clothes (with shamefacedness) but with good deeds appropriate for women who profess to worship God.<br />
This does not go to say that women should not dress fashionable, it suggest modestly not overdone or too exposed. Too much of anything is not good for you. Shamefacedness simply means not to draw attention to yourself. Anything tight or form fitting shows off your figure whether it be pants, shorts, skirts, or dressess and is therefore not shamefacedness! Men are naturally attracted to a womens curves this is how God has designed them. A women should guard herself and protect her future husband from falling short. The bible says in 1 Corinthians 13 &#8220;Charity doth not behave itself unseemly.&#8221; You shouldnt seek to do things that would cause someone to fall. Jesus says that if a man looks at a women with lust in his heart, he has already committed adultry. Being an ex exotic dancer, my apparel caused alot of men to lust after my figure and thus I lured them into committing adultry in their heart which I am not proud to admit.<br />
I have found a great link online that has some great backup biblical literature on this sort of topic. I suggest that everyone check it out. It address questions of how short is too short and the reasons why things are the way they are.<br />
<a href="http://www.momof9splace.com/sermon.html" >http://www.momof9splace.com/sermon.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Pat</title>
		<link>http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/comment-page-1/#comment-87402</link>
		<dc:creator>Pat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Jul 2011 16:38:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/#comment-87402</guid>
		<description>Ray, as a man, I am appalled that you would justify the wearing of short skirts and low cut tops.  Is there a verse in the Bible that says you shouldn&#039;t do drive by&#039;s in LA?  C&#039;mon brother.  The verses don&#039;t have to be direct.  It is all about the heart.  Men are attracted to women&#039;s bodies end of story.  God created us that way.  HINT: The only body any man should have to be concerned with being attracted to is his own wife&#039;s.  You are right that people don&#039;t have the right to dictate how others dress.  This is not about rule, it is about love and respect for each other.</description>
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Ray, as a man, I am appalled that you would justify the wearing of short skirts and low cut tops.  Is there a verse in the Bible that says you shouldn&#8217;t do drive by&#8217;s in LA?  C&#8217;mon brother.  The verses don&#8217;t have to be direct.  It is all about the heart.  Men are attracted to women&#8217;s bodies end of story.  God created us that way.  HINT: The only body any man should have to be concerned with being attracted to is his own wife&#8217;s.  You are right that people don&#8217;t have the right to dictate how others dress.  This is not about rule, it is about love and respect for each other.</p>
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		<title>By: Heather</title>
		<link>http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/comment-page-1/#comment-87309</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Jun 2011 22:08:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/#comment-87309</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the comments.  

Just a thought on the head covering discussion.  This too, is something that I have been wondering about and my husband and I read the Scriptures together and came to a conclusion we believe to fit the Scriptures (although I definitely don&#039;t think I have it all figured out and am open to clarification if someone has a better understanding than I).
  1Cor. 11:3-10 (NAS)
   3.&quot;But I want you to understand that Christ is the  head of every man, and the man is the head of a woman, and God is the head of Christ. 4 Every man who has something on his head while praying or prophesying disgraces his head. 5 But every woman who has her head uncovered while praying or prophesying disgraces her head, for she is one and the same as the woman whose head is shaved. 6 For if a woman does not cover her head, let her also have her hair cut off; but if it is disgraceful for a woman to have her hair cut off or her head shaved, let her cover her head. 7 For a man ought not to have his head covered, since he is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man. 8 For man does not originate from woman, but woman from man; 9 for indeed man was not created for the woman’s sake, but woman for the man’s sake. 10 Therefore the woman ought to have a symbol of authority on her head, because of the angels.&quot;

I agree that this passage is speaking to the context of speaking in the church setting.  Women are not to teach/pray in church without the authority of their husband (or if not married, their father, and if fatherless, the church leaders), and the veil/covering is an outward symbol of that submission to their husband.  Again, it is a matter of the heart, but that shows a picture of that submission.  Reading the whole context here (and there is even more - so read on) clearly shows that this has to do with the God-ordained roles of men and women and how we ought to submit to the authority above us (women to men (not all, but husbands and fathers), men to Christ, Christ to God, etc.) to glorify God and His plan.  So if a woman is not going to be prophesying (speaking forth the Word of God - teaching) or praying out loud in church, she doesn&#039;t need a veil, but if so, she does (which is the permission of her authority).  At least this is how it seems to me....but I would encourage you to read for yourself and not stop there.  The Bible is not meant to be broken apart and read just a verse at a time - the context is easily defiled that way.  It is meant to be read as a whole to understand the meaning.  We never read other texts or passages of other books breaking them apart and calling it good to understand what the writer is saying - its not sufficient.  Nor should we do that with the Bible.</description>
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Thanks for the comments.  </p>
<p>Just a thought on the head covering discussion.  This too, is something that I have been wondering about and my husband and I read the Scriptures together and came to a conclusion we believe to fit the Scriptures (although I definitely don&#8217;t think I have it all figured out and am open to clarification if someone has a better understanding than I).<br />
  1Cor. 11:3-10 (NAS)<br />
   3.&#8221;But I want you to understand that Christ is the  head of every man, and the man is the head of a woman, and God is the head of Christ. 4 Every man who has something on his head while praying or prophesying disgraces his head. 5 But every woman who has her head uncovered while praying or prophesying disgraces her head, for she is one and the same as the woman whose head is shaved. 6 For if a woman does not cover her head, let her also have her hair cut off; but if it is disgraceful for a woman to have her hair cut off or her head shaved, let her cover her head. 7 For a man ought not to have his head covered, since he is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man. 8 For man does not originate from woman, but woman from man; 9 for indeed man was not created for the woman’s sake, but woman for the man’s sake. 10 Therefore the woman ought to have a symbol of authority on her head, because of the angels.&#8221;</p>
<p>I agree that this passage is speaking to the context of speaking in the church setting.  Women are not to teach/pray in church without the authority of their husband (or if not married, their father, and if fatherless, the church leaders), and the veil/covering is an outward symbol of that submission to their husband.  Again, it is a matter of the heart, but that shows a picture of that submission.  Reading the whole context here (and there is even more &#8211; so read on) clearly shows that this has to do with the God-ordained roles of men and women and how we ought to submit to the authority above us (women to men (not all, but husbands and fathers), men to Christ, Christ to God, etc.) to glorify God and His plan.  So if a woman is not going to be prophesying (speaking forth the Word of God &#8211; teaching) or praying out loud in church, she doesn&#8217;t need a veil, but if so, she does (which is the permission of her authority).  At least this is how it seems to me&#8230;.but I would encourage you to read for yourself and not stop there.  The Bible is not meant to be broken apart and read just a verse at a time &#8211; the context is easily defiled that way.  It is meant to be read as a whole to understand the meaning.  We never read other texts or passages of other books breaking them apart and calling it good to understand what the writer is saying &#8211; its not sufficient.  Nor should we do that with the Bible.</p>
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		<title>By: yrdixon</title>
		<link>http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/comment-page-1/#comment-87298</link>
		<dc:creator>yrdixon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Jun 2011 18:14:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/#comment-87298</guid>
		<description>I am struggling with something in my church.  My pastor thinks I&#039;m getting into legalism when I object to all the exposed flesh that is visible on the praise team and the attire of the women in ministry in our church. Low cut blouses, skin tight leggings with short blouses that don&#039;t come down and over the buttocks, and short shorts during the service.  My husband and I are ministers and have expressed our concern to no avail.  We love the outreach of the ministry. They are reaching people that are non-traditional, such as bikers, tatooed covered women etc.  Am I in legalism? We are praying for our church</description>
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I am struggling with something in my church.  My pastor thinks I&#8217;m getting into legalism when I object to all the exposed flesh that is visible on the praise team and the attire of the women in ministry in our church. Low cut blouses, skin tight leggings with short blouses that don&#8217;t come down and over the buttocks, and short shorts during the service.  My husband and I are ministers and have expressed our concern to no avail.  We love the outreach of the ministry. They are reaching people that are non-traditional, such as bikers, tatooed covered women etc.  Am I in legalism? We are praying for our church</p>
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		<title>By: Melissa M.</title>
		<link>http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/comment-page-1/#comment-87139</link>
		<dc:creator>Melissa M.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jun 2011 18:44:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/#comment-87139</guid>
		<description>Very good article! I especially like the parts about how we communicate different things by what we wear. Maybe shorts and a tight top aren&#039;t communicating the worst, prostitute-like things, but are they communicating purity and modesty?

Also found the comments interesting here.</description>
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Very good article! I especially like the parts about how we communicate different things by what we wear. Maybe shorts and a tight top aren&#8217;t communicating the worst, prostitute-like things, but are they communicating purity and modesty?</p>
<p>Also found the comments interesting here.</p>
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		<title>By: Erin</title>
		<link>http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/comment-page-1/#comment-86779</link>
		<dc:creator>Erin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Feb 2011 16:05:20 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>This is another excellent article. The comments and conversations are very interesting, too. It is good to read these to see what other people say and think. 

I hope this counts for the #Feb2011NCAgiveaway.</description>
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This is another excellent article. The comments and conversations are very interesting, too. It is good to read these to see what other people say and think. </p>
<p>I hope this counts for the #Feb2011NCAgiveaway.</p>
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		<title>By: MInTheGap</title>
		<link>http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/comment-page-1/#comment-85646</link>
		<dc:creator>MInTheGap</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 Oct 2009 20:11:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.minthegap.com/2007/07/12/what-does-the-bible-say-about-modesty/#comment-85646</guid>
		<description>You are certainly entitled to believe that all you have to do is not wear braids, jewelry and fine clothes.  The question then comes up-- why not?  What&#039;s the purpose?  The answer is in your passage.  You should be more focused on your inner self than outer.  So if you&#039;re drawing attention to the outer self-- through wearing clothing to show off your body-- how does that fit in with this passage? 

And I would also argue that you have to take into account passages such as Romans 14 and Matthew 6.  In the latter, Jesus taught that if one sins in the mind, it is like sinning with the actions.  In Romans 14, Paul talks about trying to prevent others from stumbling.  If we take these principles together with 1 Peter, the picture that I get is that men and women have the obligation to take care not to tempt one another-- sexually or otherwise.

As far as head coverings, I don&#039;t believe that you have the context right when you say &quot;in a public place.&quot;  Specifically, I take it to me in church, but the argument could be made for &quot;wherever the woman prays.&quot;  I have personally wrestled with this one for a time for the exact reasons you state.  I have yet to hear a good answer for someone saying that we don&#039;t have to observe this because it was &quot;cultural&quot;.

I&#039;m not trying to &quot;dictate how other people dress.&quot;  I&#039;m trying to help those that want to look at modesty to be informed.</description>
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You are certainly entitled to believe that all you have to do is not wear braids, jewelry and fine clothes.  The question then comes up&#8211; why not?  What&#8217;s the purpose?  The answer is in your passage.  You should be more focused on your inner self than outer.  So if you&#8217;re drawing attention to the outer self&#8211; through wearing clothing to show off your body&#8211; how does that fit in with this passage? </p>
<p>And I would also argue that you have to take into account passages such as Romans 14 and Matthew 6.  In the latter, Jesus taught that if one sins in the mind, it is like sinning with the actions.  In Romans 14, Paul talks about trying to prevent others from stumbling.  If we take these principles together with 1 Peter, the picture that I get is that men and women have the obligation to take care not to tempt one another&#8211; sexually or otherwise.</p>
<p>As far as head coverings, I don&#8217;t believe that you have the context right when you say &#8220;in a public place.&#8221;  Specifically, I take it to me in church, but the argument could be made for &#8220;wherever the woman prays.&#8221;  I have personally wrestled with this one for a time for the exact reasons you state.  I have yet to hear a good answer for someone saying that we don&#8217;t have to observe this because it was &#8220;cultural&#8221;.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not trying to &#8220;dictate how other people dress.&#8221;  I&#8217;m trying to help those that want to look at modesty to be informed.</p>
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